I'm suspicious about the actual numbers that were released, not the timing of the unemployment rate announcement.
I can understand what you are saying here Books, I think we disagree that Obama is not a leader, if the other side will not act in a reasonable way no matter what, as they are on record as saying, I don't think anyone could be effective in building bi-partisan support. Think about that, there will always be gridlock and political back-biting, but I cannot recall in recent history where the opposing party went on record, stating they will vote against the President no matter what. I think it is a miracle that he did get the small amount of bi-partisan support (2 gop votes) that he did on the 2nd stimulus. Obama got flack from some on the left for what they believed was pandering to the right, just to get them to the table. Perhaps we just see this differently, and thats ok.
haha such a funny thread, a debate being treated like it's consequential to who wins, conspiracy theories about jobs numbers. It's the usual cast of nuts in America.
That is one of my main problems about the other side. When the facts don't line up with their rhetoric, they come out against the facts, or create an parallel biased group to confuse the people.
A true leader? Book so basically its his fault that publicly voted officials would rather put party ideology ahead of people? What I seriously don't understand about your ilk is that this man can get credit for absolutely nothing he's done but shoulders ALL the blame. How about people who have been entrusted with the public welfare actually do their jobs instead of just trying to "defeat" the president just to make a damn point. He has reached across that damn aisle like crazy and they keep slapping his hand away. He even has attempted to give them what they want and they still slap his hand away. They have gone on record saying they would never agree with him on anything but that's his fault? Are you serious? You are way smarter than that and I expect way more from you.
You're being willfully ignorant. Read the politifacts links and discern the arguments about why some statements are labeled, 'true', 'mostly true', 'half true', 'mostly false', 'lie'. When it came to discussing his own policy and tax agenda, NOTHING Mitt Romney said was true in that debate. You can't run on lowering taxes as your major campaign platform and have that argument be a LIE. It's acknowledged by most political commentators after the fact that Romney told lies at an unprecedented level in that debate. And they weren't like Obama, who confused the difference between healthcare costs versus healthcare premiums. Mittens is promising @$5 trillion in tax cuts without detailing the offsets in spending cuts to make the whole thing revenue neutral. When Newt Gingrich calls you a LIAR, a tag he didn't use against anyone else in the GOP primary, that's a bad sign.
Book seems to be of this new breed of voters who are so incredibly disenchanted with politics and government everything sounds bad even when its not. Especially with the person who is suppose to be in charge. Millions bought into the rhetoric of hope and change, and when things seemingly got worst in this country they can couldn't help but feel like someone who got stuck with a defective Iphone. Where are all the bells and whistles I was promised? This shit barely works? Why buy another one? The problem is they are a bunch of impatient short sighted children who grew up in this fast food society and when things don't go their way immediately they get upset. The facts are out there but unfortunately most people can't be bothered with facts, they can only relate to feelings. The feel cheated and because of that they start making up shit. Gas prices are up and that's Obama's fault. Corporations are hording profits like the world is literally on brink of collapse. Blame it on Obama. The GOP is willfully against EVERY SINGLE PIECE OF LEGISLATION brought up by Obama in an effort to make the circumstances so dire that people will vote for a Republican yet again that's Obama's fault too. To be completely honest I would have preferred Ron Paul over both of them if he weren't so damn racist, party affiliation be damned. I want the best person for the job. I don't think its the job of government to take care of people, its the job of people to take care of people. However if you enter into a social contract with me and take up to 30% of my money I damn well expect a return. They constantly bitch about government getting to big but I don't see a single one of them taking a pay cut to lessen the burden on the people, even those who are fricking millionaires and don't need the salary. Say what you will about Bloomberg but him only accepting a dollar a year as pay to run NY gives him a lot of clout with voters. Bottom line is a lot of politicians are liars and are self serving but the right seems to be the part of lunacy, the party of oppression, and divisive action. The only reason Republicans have success with reaching across the aisle is because Dems are willing to reach back. They don't have a fuck the little people until I get my own way mentality.
Interesting the way you see it, introducing facts that run contrary to a stated position is not "heat", its called a reasonable debate. We can agree that name calling is not called for.
I see some truth in what you are saying here. I do think it is important to introduce facts where it is possible that someone is forming an opinion without the benefit of all of the facts. The nature of politics is to play "hide the ball" when it comes to the truth of the matter on just about every issue, whatever paints their side in the best light possible. Most Americans are easily swayed by rhetoric, spin, and partisanship, especially if those speaking look like them, or they somehow identify with what is being said, facts, reason and logic just don't enter into the equation for them. 2:52 of the video below is a classic example of what I am saying, and yes before you say it, it does go both ways and there are videos of equally uniformed, lemmings following demagogues on the liberal side as well. All the more reason to bring as many facts to light as possible IMO. 2:25 is probably the best example of the thinking, or lack there of, of most voters. [youtube]pilG7PCV448&feature=related[/youtube]
The motives of the questions are clearly designed to make the GOP look good, that being said, there is no excuse for the ignorance shown, especially the first couple of questions about who controlled congress in 2008 and who Frank, Pelosi and Reid are. [YOUTUBE]53C2-b8BOLs[/YOUTUBE]
I'd be suspicious about any clip that didn't also show people answering those questions accurately. Of course you're going to have a portion of the electorate that is uninformed about political matters, but not 100% of people who are asked a set of questions about the federal government.
Kanye told THE TRUTH. He didn't say Bush was a bigot or racist. He said Dubya was apathetic about the plight of poor Black Katrina victims, specifically referencing the slow FEMA response to the Hurricane survivors in Louisiana. Considering it took the federal government 3-4(?) days to send in aid, how was Kanye wrong?? Also there's a difference between a volunteer political activist for a particular campaign or political party demonstrating profound stupidity and ignorance, and some random voter who's got rocks for brains. If you interview the average Obama campaign volunteer compared to the typical Tea Party activist, there would be no comparison.
True statement, TDK asked for a link and I was obliging showing "some" liberals with the same level of ignorance as on the right.
Book I am sincerely curious when I ask, have you/do you converse with any black people outsode of this forum? For people like you does someone need to hang black folk and call them racial insults for you to believe they're racist. I mean wow come on
