The Culture Wars: Pro-Life vs. Pro Choice

I agree that the social net needs to be fixed to help people especially in the second worst financial disaster in US history. You have no argument with me that it needs to be fixed.

 

But the overall point is its not being fixed. We don't have a system beneficial for those in power for it to be fixed fam so we are forced to deal with this shit storm which is why I don't think bringing more innocent souls that won't be taken care of is not a good idea. If you don't personally have the means to take care of a child and you know that and you decide not to have kids because of that its really a smart decision.

 

While I can certainly agree that people should think about if they can afford the child before participating in activities that can form the child, I don't think abortions are a solution to fixing a terrible social net. You and I can fall and have to use the social net. If it isn't fix, it won't matter how many abortions there are. We will fall through the net.

 

Nobody cares what you do with your body until you get pregnant. Then they could care less about the baby when it gets here. How many of the pro lifers have adopted kids?? AT 16 trillion our national debt is greater than GDP but people that make 50,000 are really supporting these kids for 18 years by paying taxes. :smt030(Thanks for that revelation Arch) (Yeah rich people may be causing the problem but 50 friggin grand at the current rates is not helping) Personal responsibility?? Well at least we should be able to come together as a country and be responsible enough to pay this DEBT down! That is the responsibility of us ALL. Can we do that?? Until we can work together collectively as a country why the hell should a pregnant woman let someone else tell her how to be responsible?? At the end of the day we all go home pretending that 16 trillion is just another fucking number and it is the problem of the next person. If we don't give a damn about our own country, lets stop pretending that we care about the welfare of someones body or child. Our country cannot afford to take care of these kids, because we simply don't care enough to pay the debt down. There may be some people on this forum that care, but lets be realistic and realize that most people do not. There is a sobering reminder that people tend to be selfish. 16 trillion dollars worth.

 

Well you can actually look at it this way the more aborted unwanted pregnancies the less people on the social safety net giving there more room to catch you and I if we need the help. We've contributed to it for years it should be there for us.

 

Still doesn't fix it and it is the people who contributed that take more than their share when they are old. aka medicare

I'm actually on the other side. The less old people there are, the less people on the social net. Old people cost more than anyone. One of my co workers suggested we all simply place a pillow over all of the babyboomers faces and we would save the country but we all love our parents too much to do it even though we all know that they are going to crash the system when they go into retirement.

 

To be fair Beasty, even though I agree with the sentiment, the vast majority of us should not be held accountable to pay a debt ran up by a few. The average working person didn't make decisions that lead to this bs. It was a collusion of the wealthy and dirty politicians that privatized gains and socialized the hell out of losses. We could all sacrafice to pay it off but then what? They would most certainly do it all again. This is much bigger than debt or abortions. I actually think Arch, Paniro, Ches, and Bliss have it right, it is about responsibility but not just personal. It is long over fucking due that we have to realize we are responsible to one another. Time to put down the fucking ipad, stop facebooking, and start asking what can I do to help, what can I do to change things rather than sitting in warm home complaining about what others should do.
Fucking quote me I'm brilliant damnit.:rock::rock::rock:

 

Older people actually have wealth and have contributed not to mention they may have knowledge we still need, they can offer and the most important fact THEY ARE ALREADY HERE. No one is suggesting the opening scene of 300 but flushing out cells akin to dry skin sells you shed is not the same thing to me.

 

It cost more to fix them than it cost to fix children. Their money will go to their children so the wealth is still there. They won't be here in 100 years. You got to look out father than 20 to 50 years. You need a population.



note: I am not arguing we start killing old but simply they are a burden to the social net. These people had over 60 years to create stable financial environment. why do they need Medicare?

 

We have 7 billion fricking people on this planet we really don't need anymore fam. And like I said you're killing someone who is already here who has contributed to the system so in turn should be taken care of.

 

no, These people paid at a lower inflation rate than now. You are basically paying for all of these seniors to survive. Do you honestly think you have the money to spare for warren buffet who has how much money? That's what's going on. Each generation is supporting the last through taxes. Keep in mind the last generation paid at a lower inflation rate. It is not fair to us. It won't be fair to our system. The system is collapsing because of that. We won't get the same benefits as our parents did even though we are paying in with a high inflation rate. Not fair what so ever.

I do not agree to paying warren buffet's medicare.

 

The elderly helped paved the wave for us, teachers who taught us, policeman and firefighters who protected us, nurses and doctors that healed us, along with a slew of other people who gave people like me a great childhood/existence up until this point. The things you are enjoying right now didn't take place in a vacuum fam they came from people before us and I have no problem with them because again THEY ARE ALREADY HERE. I don't your desire to ignore them because they are old but defend life that isn't here yet. So much for prolife

 

Their job as with every other generation is to make sure that the next generation is better off than them. They are not doing that with us. We are going to be handed a worse country than what they got. We will get worse medicare benefits. We will receive a terrible education system. We will receive a terrible social net. In fact you said it was a hype. Inflation is even higher than before. tuition inflation is higher now than ever. This makes it harder for the next generation to get out of poverty. It is totally unfair.

I can go on and on and on about how the generation in power has screwed every generation after it.

My argument is not that they should or shouldn't live. I think they should. I am arguing that they cost more and have given great power but have cost so much to generations afterwards. i.e. you and me.

doing the right thing is the default. You are pointing to all that they have done that has been. That's great. Each generation in power suppose to do that but when you look at all the crap that has happen. It is terrifying.

I am starting to see what you mean about bringing in life when you have such a fucked up country.

 

To be fair to the last generation they were lied to and mislead. Having a misinformed public is the easiest way to manipulate them for the bebefir of the few

 

That's pretty much my point. 1.) As a country we cannot agree on how to solve the problems that we have in common, why then should we tell people how to handle their own personal business. 2.) If we did come together to solve the problems, its only a matter of time before those problems reoccur, because most people are selfish. ...........Therefore let's refrain from telling pregnant women what to do with their bodies, people already have enough on their plates as is. .......You lost me on the rest of your post.

 

what are you smoking??!!

 

If you look at the cost of medicare, it is higher than say chip. I wouldn't have an issue with it, if medicare simply paid out what was paid in but I don't think that is the case. If someone could show me differently, I'd be very very happy. It would mean that I would get the same benefits as the babyboomers will get. Medicare seems like if you pay into it no matter the cost, it will get paid. Who is paying the fees that cost more now than back when they paid into it?

 

I understand what you are saying, but if we turn our backs on old people the same could be done to our generation when we get older. Look at what you would be teaching the kids. .....Why should I keep paying into a system that may turn on me one day when I become old??

 

medicare and all of the other programs were realistically not designed for seniors to survive on. The assumption was, that within 60 years, you would have built enough wealth to survive(this was not the case of course. People are reckless but 60 years man .... If you poorly mange money for 60 years, I don't know what to say). Honestly, seniors are adults and they kind of knew old age was coming. It isn't a big surprise for any of us. I would certainly agree that if you paid 20 in then you should get 20 out but I just don't know how that is done with such high medical bills. It looks like you pay 20(or whatever they pay) in and you got out almost any care no matter the cost and the generations behind you pay the bill. again, I don't have the money to pay Warren Buffet's medical bill. If someone could prove opposite, I would be thrilled to see stats on it. It would mean that they don't need to cut Medicare and other senior benefits since we can afford it.

 

Pretty sure is it about the way you described it, but if we are going turn our backs on old people I much rather my taxes go to my own retirement accounts that I control. Go ahead and slowly can the system, just allow me to stop paying into it.:smt036