Star Wars

[The Dark King]

It takes more courage to defy your upbringing when you realize how wrong it is than it does to toe the line.

This guy seriously can't win with you. It's a shame you can't see the strong character that's right in front of you.

I saw a guy fresh out of basic scared as fuck of war. He was more of an ancillary character not a main one to me. I just wanted far more strength, maybe he'll be better in the up coming films but for me as a black nerd I was desperately hoping for a young Mace Windu. Someone bad ass smart and brave not the same ol emasculated lame

 

[goodlove]

It takes more courage to defy your upbringing when you realize how wrong it is than it does to toe the line.

This guy seriously can't win with you. It's a shame you can't see the strong character that's right in front of you.

i get what you are saying

like i stated a lot of bros were kind of pissed that he came off as weak.

 

[orejon4]

Sorry I'm one of those book people. With Luke being his Uncle Kylo trained early. Similar to his grandfather actually where he had years of training before turning.

I haven't read this book, so I wasn't clear on the amount of training. In the EU, Luke is rebuilding the Jedi Order to fight the Yuzhan Vong, and Han and Leia have other kids who are in training. In the movies, Anakin's had about 8-10 years of training, but was still an awkward adolescent in emotional turmoil, and not yet a man. From what I gathered from the movie, Kylo and his fellow padawan weren't anywhere near that, which made me think that he hadn't completed the journey either. They didn't have masters to apprentice to, since Luke was the only one training them, and we all know what happens when you are trained by a Jedi Knight as opposed to a Jedi Master. Remember Obi-Wan's less than stellar record with Anakin? And no Jedi Council, standardized training, temples, etc. And (sounding like a real geek here) maybe he has fewer midichlorians in his bloodstream, lol.

 

[archangel]

Ran away from the Storm troopers and kept running only standing up to them when absolutely necessary, no real direction other than run run run away. And the wielding of a light saber against a trained fighter with force sensitivity was absolute horseshit. I absolutely hate when they do that. It's like you or I getting into the ring with Rousey we'd get our asses handed to us quick

Let me remind you that much like Luke skywalker it would have been him vs a whole military and luke had kenobi, Han Solo, leia and some driods.No idiot would fight a whole military plus a somewhat trianed jedi on their own. cut the guy a break. You aren't being realistic(yes, I know it is a movie but in that context). This was written before and Luke fled as well. a lot of similarities.

either he is a pansy or too powerful....walk the line finn..

 

[The Dark King]

Again, we don't know how long he or exactly how much training he under took under Luke. Remember, when Luke was training under Yoda he initially thought all of the shit he was learning was pointless. Basically the same thing with the Karate Kid when Miyagi had him doing "Wax On/Wax Off" and "Paint The Fence." Being that he was clearly seduced to easy path of the Dark Side, he probably was of the mindset that Luke and Jedi path was some bullshit.

I can see this but he had to be at some decent level to be stopping blaster beams mid air shit even Vader just deflected.
Like I said dude could move shit with his mind Finn should have been light work no real battle

 

[The Dark King]

Let me remind you that much like Luke skywalker it would have been him vs a whole military and luke had kenobi, Han Solo, leia and some driods.No idiot would fight a whole military plus a somewhat trianed jedi on their own. cut the guy a break. You aren't being unrealistic(yes, I know it is a movie). This was written before and Luke fled as well. a lot of similarities.

either he is a pansy or too powerful....walk the line finn..

Not judging him for running I'm just saying it doesn't scream strong character. Like you I'll just wait and see I guess

 

[orejon4]

I can see this but he had to be at some decent level to be stopping blaster beams mid air shit even Vader just deflected.
Like I said dude could move shit with his mind Finn should have been light work no real battle

And don't forget, Jedi have been killed by non-Force users before: Boba Fett, Yuzhan Vong, Hutts, random stormtroopers executing Order 66, etc.

 

[goodlove]

Not judging him for running I'm just saying it doesn't scream strong character. Like you I'll just wait and see I guess

yeah give it another film.

dudes that were complaining were militant black dudes. theyll find racism in a bowl of soup

 

[archangel]

He still lost. I'm just saying that he was good enough to injure ben solo.Honestly, I feel they gave people what they wanted. They didn't give a guy who was weak but also was not too powerful.

His "power" made no sense that's all I'm saying. Seriously walk into any dojo pick up a Shinai point at someone with a year of training and say lets go. You will get your ass handed to you.

At least if it were like last Samurai where the Commander had years of battle experience with a sword not necessarily a katana then at least I could wrap my head around it.

 

[The Dark King]

I haven't read this book, so I wasn't clear on the amount of training. In the EU, Luke is rebuilding the Jedi Order to fight the Yuzhan Vong, and Han and Leia have other kids who are in training. In the movies, Anakin's had about 8-10 years of training, but was still an awkward adolescent in emotional turmoil, and not yet a man. From what I gathered from the movie, Kylo and his fellow padawan weren't anywhere near that, which made me think that he hadn't completed the journey either. They didn't have masters to apprentice to, since Luke was the only one training them, and we all know what happens when you are trained by a Jedi Knight as opposed to a Jedi Master. Remember Obi-Wan's less than stellar record with Anakin? And no Jedi Council, standardized training, temples, etc. And (sounding like a real geek here) maybe he has fewer midichlorians in his bloodstream, lol.

Dude I am definitely not one to shy away from geek talk lol
The book I read was a little different I gotta search for it but in that Kylo was a blonde and had a twin sister as well. You're right though the training was less formal it was kind of like Uncle Luke taught lessons for a weeks or months at a time and then had to bounce. He didn't really come into his own until was a pilot for the rebel alliance like good old dad.
But you do have a point about his training not being standardized and having an inexperienced teacher teach him when he hadn't fully learned himself. Much to consider I do

 

[The Dark King]

And don't forget, Jedi have been killed by non-Force users before: Boba Fett, Yuzhan Vong, Hutts, random stormtroopers executing Order 66, etc.

Mostly ambushes or people with stronger numbers and tech. Not one on one with a saber nope don't recall that all unless you count Grievice.

AND THE NERD TALK IS IN FULL SWING FELLAS lol

 

[orejon4]

Dude I am definitely not one to shy away from geek talk lol
The book I read was a little different I gotta search for it but in that Kylo was a blonde and had a twin sister as well. You're right though the training was less formal it was kind of like Uncle Luke taught lessons for a weeks or months at a time and then had to bounce. He didn't really come into his own until was a pilot for the rebel alliance like good old dad.
But you do have a point about his training not being standardized and having an inexperienced teacher teach him when he hadn't fully learned himself. Much to consider I do

A kindred soul! LMAO!

Mostly ambushes or people with stronger numbers and tech. Not one on one with a saber nope don't recall that all unless you count Grievice.

AND THE NERD TALK IS IN FULL SWING FELLAS lol

No shame in our game, lol.

 

[Ol'Skool Classic]

I can see this but he had to be at some decent level to be stopping blaster beams mid air shit even Vader just deflected.
Like I said dude could move shit with his mind Finn should have been light work no real battle

Remember Anakin/Vader was "born of the Force" so anyone of his bloodline would be ultra Force sensitive which accounts for Kylo's laser beam stopping. Who's to say that Vader couldn't do it as well? Vader didn't use Force Lightning either, but I would assume being as powerful as he was that he could and probably didn't due to his cybernetics and life support systems.


And keep in mind Kylo was injured. And he did make light work of Finn all said and done. He just went about fighting him in the typical self assured "I Have The Advantage" way and toyed with him.

 

[The Dark King]

Remember Anakin/Vader was "born of the Force" so anyone of his bloodline would be ultra Force sensitive which accounts for Kylo's laser beam stopping. Who's to say that Vader couldn't do it as well? Vader didn't use Force Lightning either, but I would assume being as powerful as he was that he could and probably didn't due to his cybernetics and life support systems.


And keep in mind Kylo was injured. And he did make light work of Finn all said and done. He just went about fighting him in the typical self assured "I Have The Advantage" way and toyed with him.

I just don't expect someone who has never used one to get actually injure someone who has. And again he moves shit and people with his mind realistically Finn should have been in seconds.

Ok here's my dilemma I was hoping Finn would have been like an Asoka Tano character not central to the story line but bad ass or even like Rex as a Storm Trooper. I guess the disappointment is on me because it's not like anything was promised.

 

[orejon4]

Remember Anakin/Vader was "born of the Force" so anyone of his bloodline would be ultra Force sensitive which accounts for Kylo's laser beam stopping. Who's to say that Vader couldn't do it as well? Vader didn't use Force Lightning either, but I would assume being as powerful as he was that he could and probably didn't due to his cybernetics and life support systems.

And keep in mind Kylo was injured. And he did make light work of Finn all said and done. He just went about fighting him in the typical self assured "I Have The Advantage" way and toyed with him.

True. And Kylo is an emotional basket case. He isn't particularly in control of himself, so it's hard to say why he does what he does and whether it's a manifestation of Force mastery, or lunacy. Maybe Vader was more focused on taking Han's pistol and punking him than holding a laser mid-air.

 

[Ol'Skool Classic]

I just don't expect someone who has never used one to get actually injure someone who has. And again he moves shit and people with his mind realistically Finn should have been in seconds.

Ok here's my dilemma I was hoping Finn would have been like an Asoka Tano character not central to the story line but bad ass or even like Rex as a Storm Trooper. I guess the disappointment is on me because it's not like anything was promised.

That seems to be the thing with some black fans of Star Wars. I've heard some people were disappointed that Finn wasn't more of a badass character and there are even some that are disappointed that Lupita Nyong'o as Maz Kanata was CGI rather than her actually being a black female character in the same way John Boyega was able to play Finn.

 

[The Dark King]

That seems to be the thing with some black fans of Star Wars. I've heard some people were disappointed that Finn wasn't more of a badass character and there are even some that are disappointed that Lupita Nyong'o as Maz Kanata was CGI rather than her actually being a black female character in the same way John Boyega was able to play Finn.

Like I said I was hoping for a young Mace or Rex so there was nowhere but down to go from there lol

 

[The Dark King]

True. And Kylo is an emotional basket case. He isn't particularly in control of himself, so it's hard to say why he does what he does and whether it's a manifestation of Force mastery, or lunacy. Maybe Vader was more focused on taking Han's pistol and punking him than holding a laser mid-air.

Every time I'm on the train and there aren't any empty seats lol

 

[orejon4]

Every time I'm on the train and there aren't any empty seats lol

*This isn't the seat you're looking for*

 

[ryanpaulstewart]

I saw the film last night and felt Finn was just as awkward and inconsistent as all the other young principle cast of characters. Each character had moments of weakness and revealed places where they will need growth in order to be fully functioning fighters.
Rey ran from her fever dream with the Luke's lightsaber, which led to her capture.
Kylo was powerful but a young hot mess of anger. Do you remember his temper tantrum with his lightsaber?
Po gave up information about which droid had the map flash drive thingy.
Also, Finn's character and behavior, in my opinion, is a surrogate for the audience.
To say Finn was a coward is stupid. He tricked the Resistance into infiltrating the death planet, the place he had desperately (read: cowardly) tried to avoid the entire movie--the source of his driving panic and fear, just so he could save his friend. That, friends, is the very definition of courage. Period. Confronting a primal fear to help someone you care about is more courageous than all the big action set schmaltz that flashes across the screen.
The problem with racially mapping characters is that stereotypes have no core of meaning; essentially, super strong, effortlessly courageous, suave black archetypes are a familiar (dehumanizing because they don't exist in reality) troupe and the obverse is just as stereotypical. Writers try to split the difference but viewers see the parts of the characters they want, turn the aspects they don't like into a synecdoche. Finn wasn't a perfect hero so he is interpreted in the light of his shortcomings and not his virtues.